January 2005 - PGCanada - lists.pglaf.org

FWD: [d@DCC] Manitoba Life and Times
by Wallace J.McLean 19 Jan '05

19 Jan '05

Forwarded from Digital Copyright Canada >From John Lange Sent Tuesday, January 18, 2005 6:54 pm To Copyright DiscussionsCc Subject [d@DCC] Manitoba Life and Times Manitobia: Life and Times (http://www.manitobia.org/) is a new initiative of the Manitoba Library Consortium. (not much on the web site yet but read the PDF document for details) "The project will make a wealth of material on the history of Manitoba available to everyone." In short, the project aims to take a variety of old documents (mainly newspapers) digitize them using OCR, and make the available in a searchable database. Interesting in terms of discussions here because; 1) if copyright was not limited this project wouldn't be possible; and 2) under the recommendations of the Heritage committee, all content will be presumed to be copyrighted and schools will pay a levy in order to access it. -- John Lange

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Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations
by Wallace J.McLean 18 Jan '05

18 Jan '05

----- Original Message ----- From: Andrew Sly <sly(a)victoria.tc.ca> Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 6:20 pm Subject: Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations > Then the question reloves around your use of the phrase > "the author's identity becomes known". What needs to be > considered done for that to have happened? That's why we need to see if there's case law on point, above and beyond the Copyright Board decision I noted earlier. We have to go back and look at the current section and its predecessors to see if there is precedent, and a look at comparable US, UK, Ireland, Australia, and New Zealand decisions, if any, wouldn't be bad either. > For the purposes of copyright clearance for PG Canada, > how much research needs to be done to show that an > author's name has not been made public? Can't be definitive, but I'd start with the AMICUS database, the copyright database, for what it's worth (not much), Google, and the standard literary reference books. There's another route that may be required, but I'm not going to post that publicly. > (Copyright laws that have you trying to prove that > something has _not_ been done are seldom any fun.) Any laws that do that...

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Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations
by Wallace J.McLean 18 Jan '05

18 Jan '05

----- Original Message ----- From: Andrew Sly <sly(a)victoria.tc.ca> Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 5:58 pm Subject: Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations > but where, during that term, the author's identity becomes commonly > known, the term provided in section 6 applies. > > That's what I see as a potential challenge for PG Canada. If we do > clear anything under a rule based on this provision, how do we > prepare for the small chance of someone coming forward with an > author's name for a previously considered anonnymous work? "A previously considered anonnymous work" can only become something other than "anonymous" during that fifty year post-publication term. ("during that term..." Since a PG Canada can't assume public domain status until publication+50 has run out, and the owner of copyright can only claim the life+ term before publication+50 runs out, a PG Canada doesn't have to worry one little bit. If the author's identity becomes known on New Year's Eve, then the work just continues under copyright and we wouldn't have been able to use it before then anyway. If the author's identity becomes known of New Year's Day, then it doesn't change the fact that copyright has expired.

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Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations
by Wallace J.McLean 18 Jan '05

18 Jan '05

----- Original Message ----- From: Andrew Sly <sly(a)victoria.tc.ca> Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 3:18 pm Subject: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations > That makes me wonder then, that in a work published by and > copyrighted by a corporation, if an author is not credited, > and cannot be determined, could I look to acertain a copyright > term on the basis of annonymous authorship? Yes: http://www.cb-cda.gc.ca/unlocatable/other/2-b.pdf

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Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations
by Wallace J.McLean 18 Jan '05

18 Jan '05

----- Original Message ----- From: Russell McOrmond <russell(a)flora.ca> Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 5:42 pm Subject: Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations > > > That makes me wonder then, that in a work published by and > > > copyrighted by a corporation, if an author is not credited, > > > and cannot be determined, could I look to acertain a copyright > > > term on the basis of annonymous authorship? > > > > Yes: http://www.cb-cda.gc.ca/unlocatable/other/2-b.pdf > > Are you suggesting that anonymous works (which works with > corporate ownership tend to be) have only a 50 year term? Under Canadian law, yes, if the personal author or authors are, and remain, unknown. > I am surprised that corporations are not then "disclosing" > authorship when term is near to expire, disclosing the author who > died last given In most cases, that corporate owner itself won't even know. > that in joint authorship the "public domain public good countdown" > starts when the last author dies (or is offed... I think the > morbidity of public benefit from authors death should be eradicated). "morbidity of public benefit from authors death" < explain this phrase.

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Re: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations
by Wallace J.McLean 18 Jan '05

18 Jan '05

----- Original Message ----- From: Andrew Sly <sly(a)victoria.tc.ca> Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2005 3:18 pm Subject: [PGCanada] Canadian copyright for corporations > In the book "Canadian Copyright Law, 3rd edition" by Lesley Ellen > Harris, (which is, by the way, very pro-copyright in its tone), > it says that a distinction must be made between the author and the > owner of copyright when they are not the same "person". The duration > of copyright is still determined by the date of the author's death. If the personal author is known. If the personal author's true identity is not known, and can't be determined, then publication+50 kicks in, as confirmed in that Copyright Board decision I cited previously. I'd like to see if the courts have commented on that provision as well.

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Re: [Fwd: Re: !@!Re: PG Canada]
by Darryl Moore 18 Jan '05

18 Jan '05

Great, and here is a test of the list. Let's clear some of the cobwebs and see if we can get others involved! Russell McOrmond wrote: > On Tue, 9 Nov 2004, Darryl Moore wrote: > > >>Yea that's the right list. There just is no archive of past discussions. >>However from what Wallace says that may be because there haven't been >>any. :-) > > > There are only two months that had any, with Wallace being who tried to > raise the dead in August. > > http://projectgutenberg.ca/ > > > "Coming soon". > > Great to know that this is already started, and Darryl won't be starting > from scratch.. > >

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Re: [PGCanada] Copyright clearance for PG Canada
by Wallace J.McLean 16 Jan '05

16 Jan '05

Whoa, moderately good minds think alike! ;) I just got online to fire an email off to David Fewer! And heck, if a conference call saves me an expedition to the upper floors of Fauteux Hall, I'm, like, totally there. ----- Original Message ----- From: Darryl Moore <darryl(a)moores.ca> Date: Sunday, January 16, 2005 3:21 pm Subject: Re: [PGCanada] Copyright clearance for PG Canada > David Fewer of the CIPPIC wants to talk next week about ways in > which > CIPPIC can help PGCanada. Do you think this might be one way they > could > help? Wallace, do you have any interest in participating in a > conference > call with David? Exact date and time TBA. > > Wallace J.McLean wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Andrew Sly <sly(a)victoria.tc.ca> > > Date: Sunday, January 16, 2005 3:59 am > > Subject: Re: RE: [PGCanada] Copyright clearance for PG Canada > > > > > >>Hmm... I'm starting to wonder it would be beneficial to > >>make the time to go look through microfilm of old newspapers > >>from 1924 to see what they might have to say about this... > > > > > > The direct method of attack would be to check the Canadian > statutes > > judicially considered materials at a good law library, and from > there > > into the law reports. > > _______________________________________________ > > Project Gutenberg of Canada > > Website: http://www.projectgutenberg.ca/ > > List: pgcanada(a)lists.pglaf.org > > Archives: http://lists.pglaf.org/private.cgi/pgcanada/ > > > > _______________________________________________ > Project Gutenberg of Canada > Website: http://www.projectgutenberg.ca/ > List: pgcanada(a)lists.pglaf.org > Archives: http://lists.pglaf.org/private.cgi/pgcanada/ >

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Re: RE: [PGCanada] Copyright clearance for PG Canada
by Wallace J.McLean 16 Jan '05

16 Jan '05

----- Original Message ----- From: Andrew Sly <sly(a)victoria.tc.ca> Date: Sunday, January 16, 2005 3:59 am Subject: Re: RE: [PGCanada] Copyright clearance for PG Canada > Hmm... I'm starting to wonder it would be beneficial to > make the time to go look through microfilm of old newspapers > from 1924 to see what they might have to say about this... The direct method of attack would be to check the Canadian statutes judicially considered materials at a good law library, and from there into the law reports.

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Re: RE: [PGCanada] Copyright clearance for PG Canada
by Wallace J.McLean 16 Jan '05

16 Jan '05

----- Original Message ----- From: Gardner Buchanan <gbuchana(a)rogers.com> Date: Saturday, January 15, 2005 4:57 pm Subject: RE: [PGCanada] Copyright clearance for PG Canada > If you assume the age at death could have been as high as 100 > and the age at publishing as low as 12, you wind up with 1867. > > 90 years and 20 years gives 1885. > > Anything that falls under this rule would be a shoo-in for > PG USA, and it would be simplest to just post it there. It would be nice to have it stored in a Canadian collection, though, too. But this will provide a good argument to policy-makers to give Canadians a failsafe rule, if 19th-century Canadiana has to be digitized in the US because of a lacuna in our own laws! However, we may have a way out. We need to look at whether the 1924 term extension has ever been judicially commented on, and whether it's been found to be retroactive or not?

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